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Discussion in 'Sport Series (570S, 540C, 570GT, 600LT)' started by iloveferrari, Jul 12, 2018.
Numbers absolutely matter. If they didn't, no one would bother increasing the numbers. The reality is that you need the numbers to sell the cars. You can't sell cars that are way outclassed or moving backwards. If you could, Aston Martin would have been selling a lot better this past decade.
Whether they matter to you is one thing, but whether they matter to the overall pool of buyers is another. If Ferrari hp numbers don't go up and lap times go down, the sales will in fact materially suffer. That is almost a certainty.
I want to know my car can run a 1/4 mile in 10 seconds, or 0-60 mph in 2.3 seconds or complete the Ring in record time. I may not utilize those capabilities to their fullest, but it is comforting to know they exist. But I also insist that the car meets my predilection for driver engagement, excitement and thrills.
The latter 3 are more important to me. Hence the HP spyder and 458 Spider vs 720s etc. Love the drama.
Once you are at the level of acceleration of a 488 or quicker, I think that throttle response is far more important in a car used principally on the street than having even quicker acceleration. You simply can't stay on the accelerator very long in these cars without substantially exceeding the speed limits. On the other hand, immediate high torque throttle response with no turbo lag can bring a smile with every touch of the accelerator.
The point I made regarding numbers and accessibility thereof has been clearly missed by a certain few seeking to gain traction with their thin and rather pathetic argument.
600LT will no doubt be a far more exciting car to drive than 720. This talk of 720 racetrack excitement/performance becomes moot for most who use these cars 95% on the road. As these (720, 600, 488, Lp etc etc) are all essentially road cars it's all about how they evoke emotion in that environment which becomes the most important factor - along with the overall ownership experience. OK, that said, Posers need not apply here.... having a totally different criteria ranging from the usual bar talk bragging rights to gaining as much attention as humanly possible whilst amongst a crowd (not that they would ever admit that). Also, if you want a dedicated track car there are more exciting cars for far less money..
It is ok for you to not like the 720, that is your perogative. We've been through this. However, whether you like it or not it is an exceptional car at every level. How you feel is subjective but comparing it to a Camry is another example of your uniformed opinion and gross bias. Your first Ferrari and such an incredible fanboy - spread your wings a bit. It is ok to enjoy and appreciate other things. If you don't like them at least have some common courtesy and respect for others who feel otherwise. It's all good man, don't be such a hater.
Lol you're just butt hurt because 600LT is the better car to drive over it's big brother. Will hold value better too is my bet.
And yeah my first Ferrari with Pista on order due mid next year, a swag of 911's under my belt with a 2rs WP due in Sept - all drivers cars which I actually drive properly - makes me a one car brand fanboy . May even buy a 600LT as an addition....not sure yet. Looked at LP but simply don't fit. Camry was used as a metaphor -yet appropriate - due to 720's lack of driver engagement in areas which matter (to me). You say it's OK, "my prerogative" and "all good" not to like 720 (like so many others for that matter) yet your actions continue to indict otherwise. Best of luck with your struggle.
Typical lack of class and substance. Same as usual with you. Be sure to post a pic of your Pista when you get it. LOL
Always happy to show my new line up. But can you handle it is more the question. I guess i'm in store for more insults LOL!
sorry but your responses are highly sensitive, very uninformed and spell like someone that finally began to enjoy supercars much later in life... the ultimate fanboy... your emotional responses are highly jaded and you seem to be the only one with this conflict. Most everyone else on this thread and forum enjoy multiple supercars and appreciate them each for what they are.... the debates are great, your responses add very little value.
and its great to see that Ferrari gave a customer a Pista who is driving his first Fcar. Nice.
Seems i struck a nerve amongst “the clan”. These pathetic attempts to profile and cast personal insult only serve to confirm im bang on the money with you boys - no question there. Grow up.
Instead of wasting time on profiling and insulting others who dont agree with your POV you should try to keep on topic and talk cars.
Oddly enough, FWIW, I'm 6’6” about 265lbs and I fit great in my Performante, albeit not as good as I do in my F12. Maybe it just comes down to how a person has their height distributed. At least for me, I am shockingly comfortable.
I’m 6’6” and 265lbs and I fit great in my Performante. Not sure what I am doing different...
The objective( track and acceleration times) factors inherent to a car can fairly accurately indicate how quick the car will be. The subjective ( driver engagement, excitement, handling characteristics, etc) can only be determined by actually driving the car. One man's excitement is anothers boredom. Shadowfax however has the ability to intuitively know with certainty that the 600LT is a more exciting car to drive than the 720S without ever seeing it let alone driving it. Amazing.
Based on your size, I doubt Shadowfax will offer some rude response to your post.
Tell us more, pictures if you have any of you sitting in the car, your seat set up, etc. It is a known issue that taller people (ie., people who fit into porsche, ferrari, mclaren, etc.) won't fit comfortably into Lambo's.
The only reason I didn't buy performante was the compromised viewing/seating position and that I didn't fit comfortably with a helmet. The first day i took delivery of SV, I realized I wasn't going to fit with a helmet and had compromised seating position. I put it on my instagram page to see if anyone can help (had 133 comments). Most people who had SV or knew someone with an SV all had the similar comments about the fittment issue. Below is some representative comments:
daverossi85@bayareanady the comfort seats actually afford more headroom, as ridiculous as that sounds. I've heard Lamborghini is working on a fix so you can tilt the back of the race seats down/back a bit like you could in the lp570. Someone tried making custom brackets for them already and apparently the seat base is already in the carpet almost. Another option is tillett seats (admittedly not the best option).
bayareanady@daverossi85 thx. Lambo dealer tech told me that it could be brought down half an inch but for liability reasons they wouldn't do it. Don't think that would be enough anyways . Surprised that dealer wouldn't help though.
daverossi85@bayareanady I've heard that from a half dozen owners actually. Lamborghini knocked it out of the park with the car, but seriously dropped the ball on the "race" seats and acknowledging there's an issue with them. The fact that the comfort seats sit lower than the race seats is insane, and the fact that the dealers are basically saying ""sorry, nothing we can do" is ********. I was also told that the test cars everyone drove with race seats sat significantly lower (as in they fit with a helmet), then their cars arrived and the seat was significantly higher.
bayareanady@robert_mitchell I spike what little hair I have and it touches the lining . I knew right away that I wouldn't fit with a halmet at that setting. It is driving me a little crazy that I'm not going to be able to track the car a couple of times. It would have really driven me crazy if I couldn't do it in the 675 . Especially knowing how good these cars are or supposed to be on a track
sv_aventadorAll the above comments are correct. The only current solution is to buy after market race seats which will sit a lot lower. I have a friend doing this now
The carbon fiber sport seats ( standard in the Performante) lower the seating position by more than 2".
I think we need at least 4 more pages about Performante seats. Hey look, a squirrel!
Happy you asked. The seats come in a variety of styles and materials as well as fully or partially electric. I could go on for at least 3 more pages. What color was that squirrel?
exoticcardreamer: So I am not much for posting pictures of myself on the internet so I am afraid I can’t help with that. Regarding seating position, in the Perf I have comfort seats, and being reasonably balanced legs and torso, I found the ideal position for me is the seat about an inch or two from the furthest back, with more recline in the seat. I am able to cram my legs under the wheel and my head glides just under the roof with the exaggerated rake in the seat. The viewing position is awful, as is overall visibility. It’s damn near impossible to see a stoplight if I am at the very first spot in the intersection. The F12 fit is effortless. I am just happy that I fit and that I enjoy the cars. For me, the benefits of being huge outweigh the negatives.
I'm only really interested in how it goes on track.
My concern is its more of a mild upgrade but really just a more edgy street car, which is great as a street car.
And, we’re back on topic
You and me both.
On paper it’s got all the right stuff- even less weight (lots of that unsprung), wider track, lower, recalibrated suspension.
Visceral/fun factor- stiffer engine mounts..... the exhaust..... at night, oh my.
Videos from Goodwood are promising.
I am told I have an “early” allocation- not confirmed yet.
Just so you know, Mclaren knows numbers matter but reality is different from perception. The reason they sandbag #s is because they know they need to have better advertised acceleration with each new model. In reality the 720S is about as quick as a car can get (think P1) and the 570 is 650S quick.
Wow.... wasn't this about the 600LT? But it brought all the typical internet magazine racers out arguing about tenths of seconds in some magazine. Unfortunately, most owners of these cars are more into the right valet spot than threshold braking and picking the right apex through a corner.
The 600LT will probably be brilliant to drive and (in the right hands), be an absolute weapon on a track.
I've been a Ferrari guy for 30+ years. Everything from an F40 to a CS have graced my garage and I have to admit the first time I drove a 570 I was sold. McLaren's have been the first car in a long time that have gotten me excited. The 570S' performance as a package is astounding. Aside from the car's performance (there is no lag if you drive it correctly), it was the way I was treated at every McLaren dealer........ I was treated as a valued customer (as it should be). Unlike the Ferrari (we are doing you a favor) attitude.
As to the reactions from the public..... the Ferraris could range from a thumbs up to a middle finger. The Mac just seems to bring smiles from everyone and at least where I live, everyone knows what it is. Not that I care, but it has surprised me.
I have been a racer and a high performance driving instructor for a long time. I haven't had the 570 at the track yet, but I have attacked several of my favorite roads and it is brilliant. The carbon tub is an amazing platform and just plain superior. I have the track pack and the factory sport exhaust and I think it sounds great.... even though all the web experts moaned that it was terrible. I know looks are subjective, but to my eyes, it gets better the more I look at it and the details. The 600LT moves the game on.
Mine has been reliable so far. I bought barely used and saved 25%. I doubt I'll get hurt since my cars tend to stay around a long time. All these things depreciate (except the F40 and CS so far). The object is to try and not get hurt too badly.
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